Oct. 6, 2026

027: From Richemont Luxury to Detroit Soul with Brandon Little

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Get the FREE WatchSmarts Beginner Buyer's Guide

Brandon Little joins David Newman to share a legendary 35 year career that began in the vanished flea markets of New York City and reached the absolute heights of Swiss luxury. From designing for Dunhill and Cartier to serving as the Chief Creative Officer for Fossil and Shinola, Brandon has mastered the art of storytelling through mechanical objects. He explores the transition from half million dollar high horology at JLC to the fun, expressive world of fashion watches, eventually leading to the launch of his own modular brand, ARTEFKT. By applying high luxury methodology to a serviceable and rugged design, Brandon is redefining what a modern timepiece can be. Whether discussing the beer garden culture of Baselworld or the technical struggle of manufacturing a perfect leather strap, Brandon reminds us that watches are the ultimate signifiers of our own personal milestones.

⏱️ Timestamps
01:05 : Introducing a Design Legend

David introduces Brandon as a guest who uniquely balances experience in big brands, micro-brands, and design.
Setting the stage for a professional journey that spans from New York City to the heart of Switzerland.

01:49 : The Flea Market Spark

Brandon recalls the amazing weekend flea markets on 7th Avenue that sparked his lifelong love for watches.
How a background in metalsmithing and men's clothing led him to purchase his first vintage pocket watch.

02:55 : The Richemont Creative Academy

How a guy from southern Louisiana ended up designing for global giants like Cartier, Panerai, and Van Cleef & Arpels.

The pivotal move to Milan that shifted Brandon's career fully into the world of luxury watch and jewelry design.

04:36 : The Automotive History of Dunhill

Exploring the incredible archive of Dunhill watches and their unique slanted designs for easy viewing while driving.
Why many vintage Dunhill mechanical movements are undervalued hidden gems worth searching for on eBay.

06:50 : Living at Jaeger-LeCoultre

Brandon describes living in the fields behind the JLC building in the Vallée de Joux while working on the 450th anniversary Reverso.
The intensity and dedication required to work alongside the old-world artisans of traditional watchmaking.

08:34 : Bringing Luxury to Fossil

Transitioning from high luxury to Fossil and bringing a Michelin star methodology to the world of fashion watches.
Managing a massive portfolio of licenses including Burberry, Armani, and the revitalization of Zodiac.

12:25 : The Culture of Fun

How Fossil and Swatch changed the industry by making watches expressive, collectible, and playful.
Why a watch should bring a smile to your face rather than being a purely serious accessory.

16:35 : The Baselworld Beer Garden

Memories of the golden era of Baselworld where collectors of all levels mingled over cheap beer.

Why the ability to share stories is more important than the competitive nature of high-end collecting.

18:21 : Rebuilding Detroit with Shinola

Moving to Detroit to oversee design for Shinola's watches, clocks, and desktop accessories.
The significance of the manufacturing and assembly investment that brought watchmaking back to the United States.

22:00 : The Challenge of the Strap

Brandon reveals why manufacturing a watch strap is more technically difficult than most people imagine.
The rewarding process of building a factory that takes raw leather from point A to a finished luxury product.

24:39 : Launching ARTEFKT

Why Brandon decided to leave the corporate world to design a watch specifically for himself.

The mission to create modular, high-tolerance, Grade 5 titanium watches that are built to be easily serviced.

31:36 : Luxury Marketing vs. The Hard Sell

Why the best brands provide a space for acquisition and storytelling rather than a forced transaction.
The importance of engaging honestly with the global community through watch fairs and local meetups.

43:20 : Parting Advice for Beginners

Brandon encourages new collectors to ignore the snobbery and just enjoy the process of discovery.
Why cutting your teeth on a vintage Casio or Timex makes you appreciate a future Grail watch even more.

A great watch is not just a tool for telling the time; it is a mechanical record of the journey you have taken to get where you are today.
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NOTE
This file was generated by Descript

00:00:00.031 --> 00:00:01.792
Brandon: Watches frankly
are loved by everybody.

00:00:01.792 --> 00:00:05.839
Everybody loves a wa- I mean, I've
never heard the word, "I hate watches."

00:00:05.874 --> 00:00:09.396
You know, it's, it's just you haven't
been introduced to the right one yet.

00:00:09.720 --> 00:00:13.564
Um, and then all of a sudden you are, and
then the, then the problems begin, right?

00:00:13.614 --> 00:00:19.007
David: Welcome to Watch Smarts, where
smart people get smarter about watches.

00:00:19.257 --> 00:00:20.611
I'm your host, David Newman.

00:00:20.844 --> 00:00:22.072
Let's jump right in

00:00:33.477 --> 00:00:35.830
Well, you know, we've got
folks that, uh, have some

00:00:35.831 --> 00:00:37.924
experience with big watch brands.

00:00:37.925 --> 00:00:39.798
We have some micro brand people.

00:00:39.798 --> 00:00:43.676
We got some design people, some
entrepreneur people, but I don't think

00:00:43.677 --> 00:00:47.132
we've ever had all of that in one guest.

00:00:47.213 --> 00:00:50.631
So my next guest is Mr. Brandon Little.

00:00:50.652 --> 00:00:52.070
Brandon, welcome to the show.

00:00:52.295 --> 00:00:52.781
Brandon: Thank you.

00:00:52.799 --> 00:00:53.115
Thank you.

00:00:53.138 --> 00:00:54.101
Thank you for having me, David.

00:00:54.400 --> 00:01:00.466
David: So you really do have quite a
broad swath of amazing experience and

00:01:00.468 --> 00:01:02.918
expertise in the world of watches.

00:01:03.393 --> 00:01:08.184
Take us back to the beginning, and what
was the professional journey that brought

00:01:08.184 --> 00:01:09.937
you to the work that you're doing today?

00:01:10.287 --> 00:01:10.658
Brandon: Yeah.

00:01:10.709 --> 00:01:14.179
The, um… I mean, really it was
more or less an inquisitive one.

00:01:14.187 --> 00:01:19.717
So I was cutting my teeth in New York
City, and back then, this was about

00:01:19.743 --> 00:01:26.728
35 years ago, they had a amazing sort
of weekend, um, flea market world.

00:01:26.798 --> 00:01:29.091
And that, that doesn't exist
anymore in New York, by the way.

00:01:29.091 --> 00:01:30.286
It's… It was really amazing.

00:01:30.291 --> 00:01:37.059
7th Avenue, 23rd up into the 30s were
these amazing sort of flea markets.

00:01:37.303 --> 00:01:40.544
And I frankly fell in
love with watches there.

00:01:40.544 --> 00:01:42.821
It's where I bought my first pocket watch.

00:01:43.108 --> 00:01:46.203
Uh, I was doing, uh, men's
clothing at the time.

00:01:46.208 --> 00:01:47.106
Thought it was amazing.

00:01:47.106 --> 00:01:48.372
I was really intrigued by it.

00:01:48.670 --> 00:01:52.323
I had cut my teeth earlier in my
high school years and college years

00:01:52.340 --> 00:01:56.626
in metalsmithing, so some jewelry
understanding, and then sort of

00:01:56.626 --> 00:02:00.758
found this, you know, large, I think
it was, um, you know, a ball or

00:02:00.761 --> 00:02:04.270
something of that nature, and w- just
sort of was like, "What is that?"

00:02:04.393 --> 00:02:05.642
And then what is that world?

00:02:05.643 --> 00:02:10.239
And back then, you know, you'd
have maybe one or two guys selling

00:02:10.243 --> 00:02:13.971
vintage timepieces, but not the
world you have today, right?

00:02:13.971 --> 00:02:14.246
Like-

00:02:14.320 --> 00:02:14.485
David: Yeah

00:02:14.685 --> 00:02:17.399
… Brandon: very open,
very honest, very real.

00:02:17.656 --> 00:02:19.507
Um, and sort of fell in love with it.

00:02:19.518 --> 00:02:21.402
So out of that, started designing.

00:02:21.632 --> 00:02:26.018
My career took me into accessories,
frankly men's accessories.

00:02:26.202 --> 00:02:31.860
Dunhill was very popular at that point,
still from a smoking accessory mindset-

00:02:31.860 --> 00:02:36.565
Yeah … and sort of the accoutrement of,
like, men's accessory and th- that world.

00:02:36.826 --> 00:02:40.592
And, um, just started picking away at it.

00:02:40.777 --> 00:02:46.132
Ended up at Richemont Group in a,
uh, in their, um, creative academy.

00:02:46.134 --> 00:02:49.609
So Richemont Group had sort of hit a wall.

00:02:49.612 --> 00:02:54.075
They weren't getting talent in what they
needed, so they put out a, um, created

00:02:54.075 --> 00:02:57.640
a small school underneath Richemont,
which obviously owns Panerai, Van

00:02:57.640 --> 00:02:59.445
Cleef & Arpels, Cartier, you name it.

00:02:59.789 --> 00:03:02.620
And, um, I kind of had this random idea.

00:03:02.623 --> 00:03:07.060
I was like, how, how does, um, a
guy from Southern Louisiana end

00:03:07.060 --> 00:03:11.275
up designing watches for, you
know, a Cartier of the world?

00:03:11.321 --> 00:03:14.863
And they were doing, uh, one
person from every country.

00:03:15.228 --> 00:03:18.932
I was kind of in between a couple
of things going on, put in my

00:03:18.934 --> 00:03:23.079
application and, and portfolio,
did a collection of watches that

00:03:23.079 --> 00:03:24.941
sort of represented my ideas on it.

00:03:25.274 --> 00:03:29.007
Um, and yeah, got, got accepted,
and then moved to Milan, Italy,

00:03:29.007 --> 00:03:30.135
and that kind of started…

00:03:30.135 --> 00:03:34.588
Frankly, that kind of pivoted my career
out, frankly, fully out of what I would

00:03:34.589 --> 00:03:39.415
say men's clothing or textiles, and
really into watch and jewelry world.

00:03:40.196 --> 00:03:41.282
David: Wow.

00:03:41.309 --> 00:03:42.224
How about that?

00:03:42.412 --> 00:03:47.345
So going back to Dunhill for a quick
second, I think not a lot of people know

00:03:47.346 --> 00:03:49.932
that Dunhill actually made a few watches

00:03:50.006 --> 00:03:50.805
Brandon: A lot of watches.

00:03:50.805 --> 00:03:53.945
They had an incredible history,
uh, in watches and a lot of

00:03:53.963 --> 00:03:55.709
automotive related watches.

00:03:55.716 --> 00:03:59.194
So a lot of the things… And, you
know, that was always in that world.

00:03:59.194 --> 00:04:04.616
You even then had Le Coultre, or you
had Cartier, or you had these mirror

00:04:04.997 --> 00:04:08.833
artisans in the same world producing
a lot of the watches for them.

00:04:08.835 --> 00:04:12.926
So it's frankly, some of the older Dunhill
watches are phenomenal watches and are

00:04:12.926 --> 00:04:17.317
just wrapped up in a Dunhill mindset,
which was this automotive mindset.

00:04:17.678 --> 00:04:19.469
Uh, and they really played into that.

00:04:19.470 --> 00:04:22.967
So you'll see some of their
watches back from that era that

00:04:22.967 --> 00:04:27.529
were at a slant, easy glance while
you're driving, that whole world.

00:04:27.953 --> 00:04:30.999
And they, they were in and out of
watches for quite a while, and, and

00:04:30.999 --> 00:04:33.291
then gradually kind of phased out.

00:04:33.291 --> 00:04:37.947
And then the other Masons, I think that
Richemont owns, sort of also picked

00:04:37.948 --> 00:04:41.605
up some of that slack, and then you
ended up where you're working with

00:04:41.612 --> 00:04:46.822
automotive detailers to say, "Okay,
what is the Aston Martin of JLC, or

00:04:46.823 --> 00:04:48.787
what is the Aston Martin of this, this?"

00:04:48.788 --> 00:04:48.802
Yeah.

00:04:48.981 --> 00:04:51.846
And that, that, again, that
wasn't really a world back then.

00:04:51.850 --> 00:04:55.053
You know, it was very specific, and
you didn't have these collaborations,

00:04:55.055 --> 00:04:56.047
was the word I was looking for.

00:04:56.257 --> 00:04:58.224
You didn't really have
collaborations like that.

00:04:58.224 --> 00:05:02.801
It kind of, the eras have sort of ebbed
and flowed, and that kind of picked up.

00:05:02.985 --> 00:05:03.791
But Dunhill's- Yeah

00:05:03.807 --> 00:05:04.169
amazing.

00:05:04.375 --> 00:05:08.571
Historically, Dunhill has been an
incredible resource for some really fun,

00:05:08.808 --> 00:05:10.303
uh, and interesting things happening.

00:05:10.810 --> 00:05:13.280
David: Are they still doing watches,
or are they now out of that business?

00:05:13.327 --> 00:05:14.760
Brandon: I'm pretty
sure they're out of it.

00:05:14.772 --> 00:05:18.717
They, they had a last stint about when we
were at Richemont Group, which would've

00:05:18.719 --> 00:05:22.433
been about 20 years ago to 25 years ago.

00:05:22.435 --> 00:05:24.559
They did another
collection, which was fun.

00:05:24.733 --> 00:05:27.178
Also automotive, very inventive.

00:05:27.446 --> 00:05:29.917
But, um, I think they
finally phased out of them.

00:05:29.918 --> 00:05:31.688
And some of those are
really beautiful, actually.

00:05:31.688 --> 00:05:33.631
They had some really innovative ideas, so.

00:05:34.068 --> 00:05:38.243
David: Do you sometimes see those for
sale on, like, Chrono24, eBay, et cetera?

00:05:38.297 --> 00:05:39.478
Brandon: Oh, eBay for sure.

00:05:39.514 --> 00:05:39.854
Yeah.

00:05:39.907 --> 00:05:41.648
eBay you can find them, and they're good.

00:05:41.648 --> 00:05:45.209
I mean, uh, from a mechanical
standpoint, again, it was still always

00:05:45.209 --> 00:05:49.340
in Richemont 'Cause, uh, Richemont
had started in British Tobacco, and

00:05:49.340 --> 00:05:55.344
so Richemont's group really leaned
in heavily to, uh, Dunhill early on.

00:05:55.347 --> 00:05:58.306
So they kinda helped
facilitate a lot of that.

00:05:58.525 --> 00:06:01.397
So a lot of the mechanical movements
and whatnot are, are really

00:06:01.397 --> 00:06:02.823
quite sound and worth a pick up.

00:06:03.027 --> 00:06:05.303
You'd probably buy it for really
cheap, and the movement's probably

00:06:05.303 --> 00:06:06.912
worth more than the watch was, right?

00:06:06.914 --> 00:06:07.176
So.

00:06:07.193 --> 00:06:08.284
David: How about that?

00:06:08.363 --> 00:06:08.635
Brandon: Yeah.

00:06:08.986 --> 00:06:11.816
David: And then Brandon, take
us, take us forward into the

00:06:11.816 --> 00:06:13.969
Fossil era, the Artifact era.

00:06:13.969 --> 00:06:16.034
Yeah … catch us up to
where, where things are today.

00:06:16.296 --> 00:06:20.075
Brandon: Yeah, so that ended up, I ended
up at JLC, so Jaeger-LeCoultre, in their,

00:06:20.092 --> 00:06:21.496
in their valley, uh, was where- Which

00:06:21.508 --> 00:06:22.477
David: by the way- Yeah

00:06:22.477 --> 00:06:23.952
no one knows how to pronounce.

00:06:23.969 --> 00:06:24.880
So thank you.

00:06:25.202 --> 00:06:25.450
Yeah.

00:06:25.450 --> 00:06:26.130
Thank you for doing it right.

00:06:26.130 --> 00:06:26.250
It's

00:06:26.251 --> 00:06:26.565
Brandon: tough.

00:06:26.602 --> 00:06:27.198
It's tough.

00:06:27.198 --> 00:06:27.953
And you have to live there.

00:06:27.955 --> 00:06:32.167
I mean, I lived literally in back of
the building, um, on, off the fields.

00:06:32.168 --> 00:06:35.159
They've got some, um,
apartments back there.

00:06:35.198 --> 00:06:40.287
And, um, out of that, came back Stateside,
and then I started a jewelry business,

00:06:40.287 --> 00:06:44.292
and that was how I was at Neiman Marcus
and had accounts throughout sort of the

00:06:44.293 --> 00:06:48.133
country at Neiman Marcus Precious, their
precious jewelry salon at the time.

00:06:48.397 --> 00:06:51.642
And frankly, that's how I
got introduced to Fossil.

00:06:51.753 --> 00:06:56.549
And full disclosure, I was like,
coming out of Richemont and then

00:06:56.549 --> 00:07:00.811
coming out of JLC, it was the
last place I would have landed.

00:07:00.854 --> 00:07:05.724
I was like, "What is going on?"
Like, you know, my project at, um, at

00:07:05.734 --> 00:07:10.568
JLC was working on their Tryptique,
which was w- their 450th anniversary

00:07:10.599 --> 00:07:13.155
of, of, um, the, the Reverso.

00:07:13.465 --> 00:07:17.871
So, um, massive watches
incredibly important.

00:07:18.128 --> 00:07:21.616
And I was like, "I don't know if I can
do this. I don't know if I can be a

00:07:21.618 --> 00:07:24.700
part of this, this place." Like, "What
are you doing? I don't really, really

00:07:24.700 --> 00:07:27.690
understand what you're doing." Like,
at least in the context of which I'd

00:07:27.691 --> 00:07:32.300
been trained at Richemont, which was,
you know, o- old artisan sort of style.

00:07:32.486 --> 00:07:34.501
Very, obviously very
traditional watchmaking.

00:07:34.806 --> 00:07:37.589
David: Uh, that must have felt like
going from a Michelin three-star

00:07:37.590 --> 00:07:41.647
restaurant, the best in the world,
to let me do a stint at McDonald's.

00:07:42.638 --> 00:07:43.704
Brandon: It wa- Yeah.

00:07:43.818 --> 00:07:47.976
It could, it, it could have felt that
way, and as all things do when you, when,

00:07:47.996 --> 00:07:52.836
when these situations arise, like, I never
turn down an invitation to meet anybody.

00:07:52.986 --> 00:07:56.198
Costa, uh, who was one of the
founders there, had invited

00:07:56.200 --> 00:07:57.615
me over to speak with him.

00:07:58.217 --> 00:08:02.191
And frankly, it was the interesting
segment is that I was one of the

00:08:02.200 --> 00:08:05.777
only second Americans to go through
that training, and one of the

00:08:05.783 --> 00:08:07.323
only ones back here in the States.

00:08:07.331 --> 00:08:10.985
So they were like, "Look, we need somebody
with, with what you understand how to do."

00:08:11.123 --> 00:08:14.479
And also, you know, remember I came
out of the fashion component, so I knew

00:08:14.813 --> 00:08:19.456
intrinsically how to build out large
scale fashion, color, this, this, this,

00:08:19.457 --> 00:08:23.191
and I have a sort of a, a history of
being able to work in that environment.

00:08:23.352 --> 00:08:26.212
So I had sort of the, the
fashion component, and I

00:08:26.215 --> 00:08:27.887
had now the watch component.

00:08:27.887 --> 00:08:31.577
And he was like, "Is there a way that
you could bring the methodology that you

00:08:31.578 --> 00:08:36.860
guys create watches through the lens of
Richemont here into Fossil? Um, and then

00:08:36.861 --> 00:08:41.105
also help work with our international
team." So their portfolio division,

00:08:41.304 --> 00:08:45.452
you've got Fossil and then we have the
portfolio at Fossil, which is all of the,

00:08:45.472 --> 00:08:48.728
um, was all of the licensing that we did.

00:08:48.729 --> 00:08:52.487
So you had the Burberrys of the world,
you had Armanis, you had Diesel,

00:08:52.489 --> 00:08:54.423
you had all those other things.

00:08:54.423 --> 00:08:54.808
You had over 12-

00:08:54.808 --> 00:08:55.529
David: Skagen.

00:08:55.867 --> 00:08:56.476
Brandon: Skagen.

00:08:56.491 --> 00:08:57.795
We had our house-owned brands.

00:08:57.797 --> 00:09:01.646
So we had Michel, we had Zodiac
watches, and, and, and so you had,

00:09:01.727 --> 00:09:05.451
you know, upwards of, like, 12
to 15 different things going on.

00:09:05.785 --> 00:09:08.396
Frankly, I fell in love with
the people, to be quite honest.

00:09:08.775 --> 00:09:12.131
And at the end of the day, the
process, you have to take yourself

00:09:12.145 --> 00:09:17.911
out of the process Um, or necessarily
maybe what the end what is, but

00:09:17.911 --> 00:09:19.456
the process is all the same.

00:09:19.472 --> 00:09:23.781
So we started using the same process
that we would use at Richemont group.

00:09:24.078 --> 00:09:28.325
And frankly, the creative output
for that was just as rewarding.

00:09:28.347 --> 00:09:28.358
Yeah.

00:09:28.377 --> 00:09:31.097
It was just a different…
The item was different.

00:09:31.098 --> 00:09:34.107
Of course, you know, I went from
something that cost half a million

00:09:34.107 --> 00:09:37.755
dollars to something that cost, uh, $200.

00:09:37.815 --> 00:09:38.291
Right.

00:09:38.579 --> 00:09:39.793
At least initially.

00:09:39.793 --> 00:09:44.001
And then as we sort of started to build
up that process, we started to look at how

00:09:44.001 --> 00:09:48.857
do we implement that and use scale to our
advantage and using our resources, which

00:09:48.857 --> 00:09:52.992
were amazing at Fossil during that era, to
where we could start making watches that

00:09:52.992 --> 00:10:00.045
frankly would compete with a 5, $10,000
watch, but be in that 1,250 price point.

00:10:00.093 --> 00:10:00.458
Yeah.

00:10:00.464 --> 00:10:04.338
And it became very interesting
using all of those resources, right?

00:10:04.339 --> 00:10:10.132
Storytelling, narrative, communication,
contemporary communication, um, but

00:10:10.132 --> 00:10:14.988
then also enough of an engine behind you
to where you could make an incredible

00:10:14.988 --> 00:10:19.819
product at an incredible price and start
a different dialogue with consumers

00:10:20.077 --> 00:10:22.151
that frankly, isn't that $10,000…

00:10:22.151 --> 00:10:26.385
A $15,000 watch is a lot
for a lot of people, right?

00:10:26.387 --> 00:10:26.589
Yeah.

00:10:26.631 --> 00:10:31.034
Like, and that doesn't mean it shouldn't
be an option to have something equal of

00:10:31.040 --> 00:10:32.874
value, but at a different price point.

00:10:33.222 --> 00:10:35.034
Watches frankly, are loved by everybody.

00:10:35.034 --> 00:10:39.086
Everybody loves a wa- I mean, I've
never heard the word, "I hate watches."

00:10:39.120 --> 00:10:42.635
You know, it's, it's just you haven't
been introduced to the right one yet.

00:10:42.959 --> 00:10:46.829
Um, and then all of a sudden you are, and
then the, then the problems begin, right?

00:10:47.583 --> 00:10:51.078
David: Quick commercial break here
to ask you, have you seen all of the

00:10:51.078 --> 00:10:55.671
cool resources, downloads, and guides
waiting for you at watchsmarts.com?

00:10:55.827 --> 00:10:56.736
Go check it out.

00:10:56.781 --> 00:10:57.690
You'll love it.

00:10:59.709 --> 00:11:02.829
So I wanna stick with Fossil just for
a moment, but then I definitely wanna

00:11:02.830 --> 00:11:06.603
jump next into Artifact and all the
cool things that you're doing today.

00:11:07.097 --> 00:11:13.786
Fossil, to me, and maybe this is in
retrospect, but Fossil introduced

00:11:14.077 --> 00:11:16.334
this amazing sense of fun.

00:11:16.531 --> 00:11:16.935
Brandon: Yeah.

00:11:16.988 --> 00:11:19.464
David: Some of the watches, they,
now they were serious design, but

00:11:19.466 --> 00:11:21.526
then some of them were just pure fun.

00:11:21.601 --> 00:11:21.856
Fun.

00:11:21.875 --> 00:11:25.413
Like, look at this dial,
look at this typeface.

00:11:25.422 --> 00:11:27.365
Look at the hands, look at the whatever.

00:11:27.535 --> 00:11:30.972
And then of course, we have the
whole culture behind the tins, right?

00:11:30.972 --> 00:11:30.988
Yeah.

00:11:30.997 --> 00:11:33.417
The whole packaging became collectible.

00:11:33.733 --> 00:11:36.916
Tell me about what was your
influence, what was your

00:11:36.916 --> 00:11:41.711
inspiration around maintaining
and amplifying that sense of fun?

00:11:42.487 --> 00:11:45.136
Brandon: The, I mean, the whole
company was based off of fun.

00:11:45.313 --> 00:11:49.205
You know, so I think even if you ever go,
if you would ever go to any of the, the

00:11:49.205 --> 00:11:53.876
stores at that time and, and specifically
the building, it was all about that.

00:11:53.877 --> 00:11:55.945
I mean, they would run
around with rubber chickens.

00:11:56.007 --> 00:12:01.388
Uh, they would make funny noises over
the intercoms in the middle of the day.

00:12:01.781 --> 00:12:08.193
Um, so it was very tongue in cheek, and
I think at its best, and I'll speak,

00:12:08.194 --> 00:12:12.681
you know, and I, I don't, I didn't have
that much influence over, you know,

00:12:12.681 --> 00:12:15.156
Fossil itself in terms of Fossil brand.

00:12:15.491 --> 00:12:15.693
David: Sure.

00:12:15.700 --> 00:12:20.707
Brandon: I think at its, at its best
it was humor, it was playfulness, it

00:12:20.708 --> 00:12:26.088
was storytelling, it was a nostalgia
for something that is no longer here.

00:12:26.392 --> 00:12:31.785
Um, whether that was the tins or the
robots or this or that, you know?

00:12:31.786 --> 00:12:36.353
And I think that a certain, there's
a certain place where as we, when we

00:12:36.356 --> 00:12:41.005
started the conversation just now, like
where h- uh, the human humility part

00:12:41.914 --> 00:12:45.976
The just having fun part, sometimes
we get a little bit too serious.

00:12:46.191 --> 00:12:46.791
David: Oh, yeah.

00:12:46.850 --> 00:12:49.641
Brandon: And frankly, even in,
you know, Richmond's brands,

00:12:49.644 --> 00:12:51.071
it was all very serious.

00:12:51.091 --> 00:12:56.852
And it was funny to watch as we c-
as we started to grow as a company

00:12:56.854 --> 00:13:00.666
and compete with them on certain
levels, where they all of a sudden

00:13:00.666 --> 00:13:02.428
had to start having fun again.

00:13:03.016 --> 00:13:06.038
And so Lim- Yeah … you could see
where the limited edition started

00:13:06.054 --> 00:13:08.239
to be like, we're like, "Oh,
that's something we would've done.

00:13:08.239 --> 00:13:11.318
That's a color we would've
done." Or like when Rolex now

00:13:11.336 --> 00:13:13.825
does polka dots or whatever.

00:13:13.975 --> 00:13:14.264
David: Yeah.

00:13:14.304 --> 00:13:18.043
Brandon: All of a sudden, this world
came back into play, where it was like

00:13:18.375 --> 00:13:20.196
not everything has to be so serious.

00:13:20.197 --> 00:13:24.172
Like frankly, you gotta love … None
of this makes any sense, so if you don't

00:13:24.177 --> 00:13:27.917
love it and it doesn't bring a smile
to your face, then what's the point?

00:13:28.248 --> 00:13:30.594
You know, and, and Swatch
is a great example.

00:13:30.597 --> 00:13:36.775
Swatch and Fossil sort of grew up
together in that moment back in that era.

00:13:36.790 --> 00:13:38.043
You know- Yeah … it was the '10s.

00:13:38.210 --> 00:13:39.569
It was all about fun.

00:13:39.599 --> 00:13:41.262
It was simple time telling.

00:13:41.460 --> 00:13:45.763
And frankly, it was just about being
expressive and a collector's mindset

00:13:45.895 --> 00:13:48.037
and embracing that sort of culture.

00:13:48.258 --> 00:13:51.581
And then it got a little bit
hijacked, you know, on both of them.

00:13:51.614 --> 00:13:54.275
They're like, "Oh, well let's be
a little bit more serious." Yeah.

00:13:54.275 --> 00:13:56.678
Uh, let's, let's do a
little bit more complicated.

00:13:56.678 --> 00:13:58.200
Let's do a little bit more expensive.

00:13:58.426 --> 00:14:01.447
And on the flip side, the other
group started to come around as well.

00:14:01.625 --> 00:14:04.370
And I think now everybody's
kind of settled back in to

00:14:04.371 --> 00:14:08.069
sort of like understanding that
specifically with watches and

00:14:08.081 --> 00:14:11.017
in where watches are hallmarks.

00:14:11.255 --> 00:14:13.575
They're moments in time of a collection.

00:14:13.775 --> 00:14:15.484
They're conversational tools.

00:14:15.804 --> 00:14:19.986
They're ways in which you engage with
other people in a like-minded mindset

00:14:20.267 --> 00:14:23.870
that- Yeah … it's not always about
seri- the serious component, right?

00:14:23.871 --> 00:14:26.171
It's, it is about the nuances.

00:14:26.193 --> 00:14:30.343
And frankly, the beauty of the watch world
is that you can, you could still to this

00:14:30.344 --> 00:14:36.404
day find a Fossil Defender that's 65 bucks
and an opening Swatch, you know, back in

00:14:36.404 --> 00:14:41.707
the day for let's just say 50 bucks, and
have a dynamic conversation at a meetup

00:14:41.731 --> 00:14:43.552
with a watch collector who owns a Patek.

00:14:44.097 --> 00:14:46.022
And the affinity for both are still there.

00:14:46.022 --> 00:14:47.115
And they're like, "Oh, I remember.

00:14:47.115 --> 00:14:51.239
That's when I bought that one." Or-
Yeah … "And that was I, that was the

00:14:51.240 --> 00:14:55.498
first time I bought my first watch."
And I think that for me, and, and, and

00:14:55.498 --> 00:14:59.923
maybe the car culture, the healthy side
of a car culture is similar, where,

00:15:00.048 --> 00:15:04.090
you know, we live in Detroit now so,
you know, when we have like car shows,

00:15:04.282 --> 00:15:09.233
you'll have a guy with the most run-down
thing you've ever seen, but still the

00:15:09.233 --> 00:15:14.072
same affinity and conversation as a guy
who shows up in a Ferrari, you know?

00:15:14.106 --> 00:15:14.478
David: Yeah.

00:15:14.542 --> 00:15:18.028
Brandon: And I think that that
ability to share with each other

00:15:18.029 --> 00:15:21.080
is the most important thing, and
I think that's what watches offer.

00:15:21.080 --> 00:15:26.261
And I think when the h- watch market
was very healthy- At its best, if

00:15:26.261 --> 00:15:29.603
you think of Basel back in the day
before Basel sort of flipped over,

00:15:29.612 --> 00:15:33.394
and I use this story a lot, the beer
garden was the best experience ever.

00:15:33.394 --> 00:15:39.079
You'd have a diamond dealer, you'd have
a Swatch guy, a Fossil guy, a Patek

00:15:39.106 --> 00:15:44.683
guy, a Rolex guy, all just having cheap
beer and having a good conversation.

00:15:44.740 --> 00:15:45.233
Yeah.

00:15:45.233 --> 00:15:49.615
And no, like, competitive, you don't
n- you can't stand by me or this, that.

00:15:49.617 --> 00:15:51.040
And I thought that was beautiful.

00:15:51.101 --> 00:15:54.848
And so I think, you know, the, the
market's sort of ebb and flowed, but

00:15:54.848 --> 00:15:57.458
I think it's gotten back, I think,
into the collector's world that

00:15:57.458 --> 00:15:58.909
it's, it's a good place to be in.

00:15:59.334 --> 00:16:02.850
David: Well, and then please take
us into, uh, you spent a little bit

00:16:02.850 --> 00:16:05.084
of time with Shinola also, correct?

00:16:05.084 --> 00:16:05.391
Brandon: Yeah, yeah.

00:16:05.396 --> 00:16:07.798
So after that, so I ended
up being the chief creative

00:16:07.798 --> 00:16:09.785
officer of the portfolio group.

00:16:10.146 --> 00:16:12.218
Um, and that just got very big.

00:16:12.220 --> 00:16:16.569
I kicked off a reinvented, uh, Zodiac,
kicked off Zodiac, and that was

00:16:16.569 --> 00:16:18.660
sort of one of my, my baby projects.

00:16:18.885 --> 00:16:23.163
And that was right when this
independent market was picking up.

00:16:23.685 --> 00:16:28.926
You know, the fashion market had kind
of gotten Dissolved, um, and the f- what

00:16:28.926 --> 00:16:31.771
I would say, like, the Armani watches
of the world, that kind of thing.

00:16:31.803 --> 00:16:32.139
David: Yeah.

00:16:32.195 --> 00:16:37.531
Brandon: And it opened up a door
for, you know, worn and wound, that

00:16:37.531 --> 00:16:41.531
world, that collector's world, but
very boutique, independent market.

00:16:41.922 --> 00:16:46.314
Shinola, Tom, who was a, was also the
founder with his brother of Fossil,

00:16:46.602 --> 00:16:51.514
came in and then launched Shinola,
which kind of filled back up this niche,

00:16:51.881 --> 00:16:55.048
very different market at a different
price point, so you're getting your…

00:16:55.067 --> 00:16:57.491
You're below that, you know, $2,500.

00:16:57.726 --> 00:16:58.958
On average, you're below it.

00:16:59.215 --> 00:16:59.455
David: Yeah.

00:16:59.503 --> 00:17:03.735
Brandon: Um, and at that point, I was in
a, in a r- in a, in a space where I wanted

00:17:03.735 --> 00:17:08.352
to make a shift, so we started a small
studio underneath Bedrock, and that's

00:17:08.356 --> 00:17:12.810
the founding company, the, uh, umbrella
for Shinola, Filson, and some other

00:17:12.816 --> 00:17:14.825
brands that Tom Karsonis has managed.

00:17:15.124 --> 00:17:18.526
And we started working with other
partners in a more boutique manner.

00:17:18.532 --> 00:17:24.338
So from, you know, Shinola stuff to
anyone that would call up in the popcorn

00:17:24.338 --> 00:17:27.522
machine and be like, "Hey, we wanna do
a watch," or, "We wanna do something

00:17:27.522 --> 00:17:30.748
interesting that we don't have the
ability to do," um, we would do that.

00:17:30.752 --> 00:17:34.782
And then through that, I ended up
being h- uh, over all of design for

00:17:34.785 --> 00:17:39.603
Shinola, and that brought me up here
to Detroit when we relocated about, I

00:17:39.618 --> 00:17:41.403
think that was five or six years ago.

00:17:41.759 --> 00:17:44.044
And, and, and quite
frankly, similar narrative.

00:17:44.045 --> 00:17:46.979
I mean, it was about,
all about storytelling.

00:17:47.179 --> 00:17:52.418
It wasn't the traditional tins, but
the packaging, the environment, all of

00:17:52.420 --> 00:17:58.863
those things was an over-pronunciation,
oversaturation, uh, in terms of an

00:17:58.863 --> 00:18:01.056
experience of owning a timepiece.

00:18:01.549 --> 00:18:04.306
Uh, the timepiece on your wrist
was sort of the byproduct.

00:18:04.306 --> 00:18:04.532
You know?

00:18:04.533 --> 00:18:05.497
Yes, it was good.

00:18:05.497 --> 00:18:10.266
It was all the other parts of it that
came together at the end, um, to round

00:18:10.267 --> 00:18:13.458
it out and, and it was a beautiful
experience, and it was a lot of fun

00:18:13.474 --> 00:18:14.928
to be a part of that, that group.

00:18:14.968 --> 00:18:16.483
And they're still doing
great stuff as well.

00:18:17.195 --> 00:18:21.121
David: Now, were you purely involved
in the watches there, or also

00:18:21.122 --> 00:18:24.480
some of the luggage, the handbags,
the pens, all that fun stuff?

00:18:24.500 --> 00:18:28.087
Brandon: Um, just about everything
other than the leather goods.

00:18:28.168 --> 00:18:28.442
David: Okay.

00:18:28.470 --> 00:18:28.714
Um,

00:18:28.763 --> 00:18:31.990
Brandon: so at the end towards
there from what we would call supply

00:18:32.214 --> 00:18:37.320
to clocks, pens, desktop Items
Oh, yeah … some of the jewelry.

00:18:37.320 --> 00:18:41.563
We're looking at men's jewelry, and,
um, you know, obviously all of the

00:18:41.564 --> 00:18:43.933
watches, um, and things of that nature.

00:18:43.934 --> 00:18:47.726
So it's a small team, um, and you
would sort of get the ability to sort

00:18:47.726 --> 00:18:49.183
of play and, and be a part of it.

00:18:49.763 --> 00:18:53.091
I had a lot of people come in before
me that did a lot of amazing work

00:18:53.091 --> 00:18:57.598
that, you know, I, I still, uh, know
really well and was a- able to witness

00:18:57.599 --> 00:19:02.220
at least the onboarding of the hotel,
which was an amazing success story.

00:19:02.222 --> 00:19:05.641
I, I just stayed there again
last week, uh, over the weekend.

00:19:05.647 --> 00:19:05.896
And- And

00:19:05.896 --> 00:19:06.827
David: they launched the stores.

00:19:06.827 --> 00:19:09.023
I mean, the, the retail
brick-and-mortar also, right?

00:19:09.023 --> 00:19:11.088
Brandon: Yeah, they did that
really quickly, and I wasn't

00:19:11.088 --> 00:19:12.448
there, uh, at that point.

00:19:12.450 --> 00:19:16.117
I, I was still over at Fossil at that
time, but they went full throttle to

00:19:16.120 --> 00:19:20.104
get the stores right- Yeah … um,
and get the experience right.

00:19:20.321 --> 00:19:24.111
Uh, from the get-go they had kicked
off with bikes, bikes and- Oh, that's

00:19:24.177 --> 00:19:25.255
David: right, the bikes

00:19:25.266 --> 00:19:26.739
Brandon: yeah, bikes, soda.

00:19:26.799 --> 00:19:30.062
I mean, it, it was really, it was
sort of, uh, you know … And, and Tom

00:19:30.062 --> 00:19:34.800
is, is, is, is, is really a, a genius
when it comes to sort of a- that sort

00:19:34.800 --> 00:19:39.706
of mindset and, like, creating this
totality of an environment and a story.

00:19:39.706 --> 00:19:44.330
And of course, uh, the investment
with Ronda on the manufacturing and

00:19:44.330 --> 00:19:47.912
assembly, uh, in Detroit, which was
really the backbone of it, was how

00:19:47.913 --> 00:19:50.509
do we create jobs, uh, in Detroit.

00:19:50.537 --> 00:19:54.087
And, and bringing in that assembly
plant, um, and doing, and doing all the

00:19:54.089 --> 00:19:58.527
watch, uh, movement assembly was a big,
uh, if not the biggest component of it.

00:19:58.527 --> 00:20:00.150
And then it kinda morphed and kept going.

00:20:00.477 --> 00:20:04.769
Uh, and then the watch strap factory
that we did in partnership with Ronda,

00:20:04.902 --> 00:20:09.700
I mean, with, um, uh, it was with
Berloba, sorry, and, um, was amazing.

00:20:09.751 --> 00:20:13.310
And, and, and probably, you know, when
e- we would do tours of the factory, at

00:20:13.310 --> 00:20:17.932
that point we had two different levels,
one for the, uh, assembly of the clocks,

00:20:18.117 --> 00:20:22.359
and we had the leather goods, and we
had, um, the strap, um, component,

00:20:22.359 --> 00:20:24.381
and then on the top we had movements.

00:20:24.701 --> 00:20:29.187
The, the leather, because it's so
tactile and the machinery is so big,

00:20:29.515 --> 00:20:34.004
and you don't have to have the sort of
quiet, climate-controlled environment,

00:20:34.008 --> 00:20:40.106
so you could actually have this very
Detroit-centric factory going where

00:20:40.106 --> 00:20:43.398
we're stamping leather, and it was
really, uh, one of my favorites.

00:20:43.413 --> 00:20:46.583
Making a strap, by the way, is
so much more challenging than

00:20:46.590 --> 00:20:47.888
anyone would ever imagine.

00:20:48.207 --> 00:20:50.254
Um- It, it really is.

00:20:50.254 --> 00:20:52.175
The fact that we could sell
it for whatever we sold it

00:20:52.177 --> 00:20:53.543
for was an- astonishing.

00:20:53.550 --> 00:20:53.760
It's-

00:20:53.774 --> 00:20:54.182
David: Yeah

00:20:54.188 --> 00:20:57.803
… Brandon: you bring people in and go
from d- uh, point A to point Z, and

00:20:57.803 --> 00:21:00.871
by the end of it, you know, the last
thing you do is put the logo on it.

00:21:01.241 --> 00:21:03.338
And frankly, if you mess
up, then you're screwed.

00:21:03.347 --> 00:21:03.826
You're done.

00:21:03.860 --> 00:21:05.253
You have to, like, throw it away.

00:21:05.254 --> 00:21:08.268
And so it's the most- Yeah … stressful
part is just the simple act

00:21:08.269 --> 00:21:09.705
of putting a logo on it, but.

00:21:09.793 --> 00:21:10.543
David: That's funny.

00:21:10.647 --> 00:21:15.537
Is it, is it so tough because it
gets so much wear and tear, so much

00:21:15.562 --> 00:21:17.878
pull and friction and, uh, pressure?

00:21:18.080 --> 00:21:20.458
Brandon: It is, but it's
also a really small surface.

00:21:20.471 --> 00:21:23.702
So, you know, you're working with
basically big tools on a small thing.

00:21:23.847 --> 00:21:24.321
David: Mm.

00:21:24.342 --> 00:21:27.157
Brandon: With, with movements
or watch assembly, they're,

00:21:27.158 --> 00:21:29.598
they're … the tools are specific.

00:21:29.771 --> 00:21:33.886
It's a small space, small
tools, small machines.

00:21:34.266 --> 00:21:36.546
It's all manageable on this tabletop.

00:21:36.743 --> 00:21:37.052
David: Right.

00:21:37.098 --> 00:21:39.512
Brandon: But when you're looking at
the machines, I mean, you're working

00:21:39.512 --> 00:21:44.380
with a traditional industrial sewing
machine, but you're looking at a strap.

00:21:44.380 --> 00:21:45.334
So the strap is what?

00:21:45.372 --> 00:21:48.450
18 millimeters to 16, 14 millimeters-

00:21:48.640 --> 00:21:49.024
David: Yeah

00:21:49.024 --> 00:21:51.904
… Brandon: if you're lucky, and you've
got thread, you've got needles.

00:21:52.074 --> 00:21:56.862
So it's just a different… It's a
much more craft-oriented process.

00:21:57.017 --> 00:21:57.476
David: Yeah.

00:21:57.516 --> 00:22:01.179
Brandon: You've, you've got the gluing,
you've got f- you've got stitching,

00:22:01.187 --> 00:22:03.019
you've got painted edge details.

00:22:03.020 --> 00:22:04.513
You wanna do a whip stitch.

00:22:04.918 --> 00:22:07.601
You know, every whip stitch
takes a certain amount of time.

00:22:07.822 --> 00:22:09.991
So it's just a different,
it's just a different thing.

00:22:10.015 --> 00:22:11.060
It's a different- Yeah … mindset.

00:22:11.202 --> 00:22:13.512
But again, it's on a
smaller… The thing is small.

00:22:13.512 --> 00:22:16.668
You're not working on a handbag,
you're not working on a jacket,

00:22:16.676 --> 00:22:20.188
you're working on a very small
surface, uh- Yeah … a watch strap.

00:22:20.355 --> 00:22:23.292
So it's just a different kind
of relationship in making.

00:22:23.332 --> 00:22:25.830
But, um, but, but also very rewarding.

00:22:25.998 --> 00:22:28.253
And I think that's where
Shinola really shined, is it

00:22:28.254 --> 00:22:29.832
brought all of that together.

00:22:30.131 --> 00:22:34.107
Uh, it really leaned on the making
of, um, something, you know,

00:22:34.107 --> 00:22:38.046
whether that was from scratch or the
assembly of… I mean, assembling

00:22:38.048 --> 00:22:39.602
a bike is a very different thing.

00:22:39.863 --> 00:22:42.762
The turntables when they
were being assembled on site

00:22:42.762 --> 00:22:44.418
were, uh, absolutely amazing.

00:22:44.598 --> 00:22:47.509
Big platters, big bolts, very heavy.

00:22:47.536 --> 00:22:49.330
So it was, it was really amazing, yeah

00:22:50.138 --> 00:22:55.068
David: And so there you are, big,
huge success, amazing resume,

00:22:55.071 --> 00:22:59.447
fantastic track record in the
industry, and then you just got tired.

00:22:59.447 --> 00:23:02.575
You got tired of the paycheck, you
got tired of health benefits- Yep

00:23:02.575 --> 00:23:03.690
and you said, "You know what?

00:23:04.053 --> 00:23:08.263
Let me start my own entrepreneurial
venture-" Yeah "… manufacturing

00:23:08.264 --> 00:23:12.974
beautiful, amazing watches." Tell
us what happened back in 2023.

00:23:13.021 --> 00:23:14.940
Brandon: Well, I was in the
position, frankly, I wasn't

00:23:14.940 --> 00:23:16.261
sure if I was gonna do anything.

00:23:16.319 --> 00:23:20.673
I was like, "You know, maybe I've done all
the watches I need to do." You know, I'm

00:23:20.674 --> 00:23:22.610
also pretty dangerous with, with eyewear.

00:23:22.610 --> 00:23:26.485
I was like, "Maybe I just pivot and
focus on eyewear, or maybe I go back into

00:23:26.757 --> 00:23:31.058
fashion or, you know, something of that
nature." And a buddy of mine, a great

00:23:31.059 --> 00:23:36.147
friend of mine who had worked with me for
years, Taka, um, was like, you know, "Just

00:23:36.193 --> 00:23:41.076
do one for yourself." 'Cause frankly,
I, you know, my entire career was really

00:23:41.078 --> 00:23:43.193
spent designing watches for other people.

00:23:43.325 --> 00:23:43.687
David: Yeah.

00:23:43.735 --> 00:23:45.722
Brandon: It's very different
when you're the client.

00:23:46.189 --> 00:23:49.692
And he was like, "You know, can you
be the client?" And I was like, "Oh,

00:23:49.692 --> 00:23:53.723
that's… I don't know." I didn't- … I
was like, "I don't know, Taka, if

00:23:53.723 --> 00:23:58.774
I can do that." And I took a trip,
um, sort of around the country.

00:23:58.837 --> 00:24:01.697
Um, I went to… I reengaged
with all the tours.

00:24:01.700 --> 00:24:03.210
So I went to all the wind-ups.

00:24:03.465 --> 00:24:08.083
I sat on the opposite side for the
first time of the table, if you will,

00:24:08.348 --> 00:24:11.584
going to both, uh, jewelry stores
where products were being sold that

00:24:11.585 --> 00:24:15.730
I had designed, and listening to cus-
customers buy those products, but

00:24:15.744 --> 00:24:19.562
they don't know who I am, so they just
think I'm another customer as they are.

00:24:19.797 --> 00:24:20.123
Right.

00:24:20.134 --> 00:24:25.020
Um, and then did that same thing, um,
at a couple of wind-ups and sat beside

00:24:25.059 --> 00:24:28.401
a few of the booths that I had been a
part of, that the persons working the

00:24:28.402 --> 00:24:32.469
booths knew who I was, but no one else
really did, and just listened to the

00:24:32.471 --> 00:24:36.351
stories of like, "Oh, my dad bought that
one," or, "I bought that one and I'm

00:24:36.351 --> 00:24:40.668
coming back for this one," and, "This
was a gift from my mom," and yada, yada.

00:24:40.670 --> 00:24:44.501
And I really just sort of
fell back in love with kinda

00:24:44.501 --> 00:24:45.746
where we started with that.

00:24:45.763 --> 00:24:47.713
You know, a watch is a momentum.

00:24:47.725 --> 00:24:50.820
It's a, it's a signifier of something.

00:24:50.822 --> 00:24:52.288
It's a communication tool.

00:24:52.613 --> 00:24:55.353
And so then I kinda took up Taka and
I was like, "All right. I'll see if

00:24:55.354 --> 00:25:00.574
I can do something for myself." And
then, you know- Based off of what I

00:25:00.577 --> 00:25:05.629
had learned throughout the years was
understanding exactly what I wanted

00:25:05.639 --> 00:25:07.971
to build and how I wanted to build it.

00:25:07.987 --> 00:25:12.447
So really thinking through the scale
of the business I wanted, how many

00:25:12.447 --> 00:25:17.111
people I'd want, had have involved
in it, um, the, the manufacturers

00:25:17.144 --> 00:25:21.139
I'd want to work with because I'd
had gotten to, you know, all of those

00:25:21.154 --> 00:25:25.159
people you have to know intrinsically
well and have solid relationships

00:25:25.166 --> 00:25:28.787
'cause it's, it's always gonna be
trying on the fir- i- on any practice.

00:25:29.111 --> 00:25:32.268
And then I had basically a list
of things that everyone had ever

00:25:32.268 --> 00:25:35.762
told me not to do, and I was
like, "I'm gonna do all of those."

00:25:35.990 --> 00:25:36.554
David: Nice.

00:25:36.626 --> 00:25:40.213
Brandon: I was like, "I want only
grade five titanium, and it's

00:25:40.223 --> 00:25:41.711
not gonna be a limited edition.

00:25:41.716 --> 00:25:42.875
It's only grade five.

00:25:42.875 --> 00:25:44.870
I want only cow shoe rubber.

00:25:44.873 --> 00:25:46.798
I want an integrated strap.

00:25:46.887 --> 00:25:49.000
I want it scented with vanilla.

00:25:49.034 --> 00:25:53.588
Uh, I want, you know, cost
level calibrated movements.

00:25:53.591 --> 00:25:58.254
I want the highest tolerance absolutely
possible." Um, and it's basically a

00:25:58.312 --> 00:26:02.999
triple A grade where you've got, um, the
most minimal distance clearance between

00:26:02.999 --> 00:26:04.496
your crystal and your seconds hand.

00:26:04.724 --> 00:26:08.360
Typically, you would see that like
in a, a Vacheron Constantin, kind of

00:26:08.360 --> 00:26:10.903
where that crystal really fades away.

00:26:11.261 --> 00:26:15.545
And I was like, "But, but I wanna do it
all here, and I wanna do some of that

00:26:15.547 --> 00:26:20.111
assembly, or I want at least one manufa-
one assembly center here in the United

00:26:20.112 --> 00:26:23.831
States that can do it." And understanding
that it's that high of a tolerance, I was

00:26:23.833 --> 00:26:27.530
like, "Can we make it simple enough to
where my mom could assemble this thing?"

00:26:27.983 --> 00:26:29.894
And so we started down that journey.

00:26:29.894 --> 00:26:34.298
I had the head of… head watchmaker
for Shinola had stepped out and was

00:26:34.298 --> 00:26:37.001
running his own watch service center.

00:26:37.219 --> 00:26:40.342
And I was like, "All right. Let's
also think through everything we've

00:26:40.344 --> 00:26:45.585
always hit as a roadblock in servicing.
So let's think about crystals,

00:26:45.597 --> 00:26:48.141
sizes, crowns, hands, all of it."

00:26:48.434 --> 00:26:52.196
And this started that real methodical
process and probably did that for

00:26:52.196 --> 00:26:55.855
about a year and a half down to
the bolt placement, even the bolt

00:26:55.860 --> 00:26:57.449
placement for the movement holders.

00:26:57.741 --> 00:27:00.273
Um, you know, typically they've
got different positions, and the

00:27:00.273 --> 00:27:04.391
positions ironically are in a very
sensitive position that if an untrained

00:27:04.779 --> 00:27:08.425
technicians slips, it can actually
have an impact on the movement.

00:27:08.737 --> 00:27:13.659
So we repositioned where those move- the
movement holder screws are so that we

00:27:13.659 --> 00:27:18.547
could basically in forethought say, "How
is this the w- really serviceable product

00:27:18.556 --> 00:27:23.278
but at a very, very high tolerance?" And
just started going through that process.

00:27:23.568 --> 00:27:28.053
Um, you know, I'd been around long enough
to know the math, so I know it's, it's

00:27:28.100 --> 00:27:32.349
expensive and started looking through
how do we raise the money to do this.

00:27:32.387 --> 00:27:35.952
How do we put things in position to
where, you know, we can be mindful?

00:27:36.061 --> 00:27:41.169
So we built a artifact in a modular
component, so I could be smart with

00:27:41.169 --> 00:27:45.107
my buys, but then I can reconfigure
watches in thousands of different ways.

00:27:45.497 --> 00:27:50.073
And yeah, launched it on … We ended up
launching it, we launched it through a

00:27:50.073 --> 00:27:56.192
round of Worn & Wound events first, uh,
and then we did, uh, at the last event

00:27:56.192 --> 00:28:00.173
of the year, uh, in New York, launched
a Kickstarter crowdfunding campaign.

00:28:01.041 --> 00:28:03.095
Got off the ground and, and that's been it

00:28:04.056 --> 00:28:08.219
David: Nice Yeah And I believe right
now you're wearing a Baseline 1.

00:28:08.274 --> 00:28:08.696
Brandon: Yes.

00:28:08.736 --> 00:28:09.062
Yes.

00:28:09.091 --> 00:28:13.196
I have a Baseline 1 on, and then
I've got a little, a prototype green-

00:28:13.535 --> 00:28:14.295
David: Ooh

00:28:14.312 --> 00:28:15.096
… Brandon: 1 for 1.

00:28:15.100 --> 00:28:20.232
So the fact that like I could pre-program
out as many different combinations, um,

00:28:20.241 --> 00:28:23.723
it also gives me the ability to construct
watches any day of the week, so I can

00:28:23.723 --> 00:28:26.602
kind of play a lot easier, um- Yeah

00:28:26.602 --> 00:28:27.695
with all the same components.

00:28:27.704 --> 00:28:32.111
So it's been a… That is a really
great project to think through in

00:28:32.111 --> 00:28:35.817
the fact that I was like, "I wanna
be…" I've… And, and, and it still

00:28:35.819 --> 00:28:37.457
is, I wanted to be a one-man show.

00:28:37.481 --> 00:28:41.516
So I do all the photography, all
the branding, all the communication,

00:28:41.530 --> 00:28:44.054
even though I'm failing a
little bit sometimes on that.

00:28:44.382 --> 00:28:47.693
And shipping and packaging
and all of it, right?

00:28:48.035 --> 00:28:52.339
And how can you think that through
knowing that I've been a part of massive

00:28:52.678 --> 00:28:58.190
machines to middle-sized machines,
and then now honestly in, in a, in a

00:28:58.282 --> 00:29:03.075
beautiful space that frankly I can, I
can push and pull however I, I like.

00:29:03.800 --> 00:29:06.009
David: Hey, David Newman here
with a quick commercial break.

00:29:06.010 --> 00:29:09.396
Have you seen our social media
channels that have video snippets

00:29:09.407 --> 00:29:11.022
from our favorite interviews?

00:29:11.038 --> 00:29:15.167
Check us out on TikTok,
Instagram and YouTube.

00:29:15.359 --> 00:29:17.323
Now, back to the episode.

00:29:18.784 --> 00:29:23.299
Tell me about, so the marketing,
you've got the website obviously, and

00:29:23.300 --> 00:29:26.101
we should also… I mean, we'll put
this in the show notes, but Artefakt

00:29:26.109 --> 00:29:27.989
is not spelled the way it sounds.

00:29:28.079 --> 00:29:28.265
Yes.

00:29:28.299 --> 00:29:33.141
It's kind of a cool spelling,
so it's A-R-T-E-F-K-T.

00:29:33.846 --> 00:29:33.857
Yeah.

00:29:34.096 --> 00:29:36.428
I'd like to buy a vowel,
but you can't buy a vowel.

00:29:36.428 --> 00:29:39.427
So it's A-R-T-E-F-K-T.

00:29:39.658 --> 00:29:39.851
Yes.

00:29:39.878 --> 00:29:41.487
ArtefaktWatches.com.

00:29:41.871 --> 00:29:45.148
You've got the website, you've got a
little bit of social media going on,

00:29:45.149 --> 00:29:50.369
but tell me about the in-person watch
fairs and kinda what's the biggest driver

00:29:50.379 --> 00:29:52.267
of the marketing effort these days?

00:29:52.332 --> 00:29:56.132
Brandon: I mean, the first
two years were all the shows.

00:29:56.132 --> 00:29:59.069
I did literally as many
shows as I could humanly do.

00:29:59.203 --> 00:30:01.901
And that was really important to
me, and I really actually wanted

00:30:01.922 --> 00:30:03.873
to be the one at the shows.

00:30:04.303 --> 00:30:08.065
'Cause I think especially with a new
product, a non-traditional looking

00:30:08.067 --> 00:30:11.918
product, you know, when you have it on
wrist, you know, it's 10.5 millimeters

00:30:11.919 --> 00:30:16.041
in thickness, it's very, very thin,
so it's also very complicated to

00:30:16.451 --> 00:30:18.786
understand unless you're with it, right?

00:30:19.084 --> 00:30:23.593
And to me, and that was something that
I learned in different ways both at

00:30:23.594 --> 00:30:28.099
Fossil, frankly at, at all my… At, at
Richemont Group, you know, they, they

00:30:28.099 --> 00:30:31.431
never… They always would say, and
the, and the head of Cartier would come

00:30:31.431 --> 00:30:33.495
in and give you his sort of mindset.

00:30:33.738 --> 00:30:37.446
He's like, "We don't sell
anything. We provide the space

00:30:37.677 --> 00:30:39.404
for you to acquire something."

00:30:39.539 --> 00:30:39.629
You

00:30:39.629 --> 00:30:39.688
David: know?

00:30:39.690 --> 00:30:40.221
Like- Nice

00:30:40.221 --> 00:30:42.495
… Brandon: we don't… We're…
There's no sell, right?

00:30:42.495 --> 00:30:42.622
Like- That's

00:30:42.622 --> 00:30:43.813
David: luxury marketing, right?

00:30:44.011 --> 00:30:44.021
Brandon: Yeah.

00:30:44.022 --> 00:30:46.545
There's a, there's an
invitation to engage.

00:30:46.596 --> 00:30:46.879
David: Yeah.

00:30:47.101 --> 00:30:50.783
Brandon: And, and we engage,
and we have opportunity, right?

00:30:51.101 --> 00:30:55.545
Uh, and, and in the same way even
at Fossil, it wasn't a hard sell.

00:30:55.764 --> 00:30:59.654
It was an invitation for
storytelling and fun, and, "Well,

00:30:59.654 --> 00:31:01.408
I haven't seen that before," right?

00:31:01.849 --> 00:31:05.158
And, and at Shinola,
very similar narrative.

00:31:05.173 --> 00:31:10.115
It- we created this space for community
to come together and enjoy all of

00:31:10.116 --> 00:31:11.473
these things that we were making-

00:31:11.493 --> 00:31:11.845
David: Yeah

00:31:11.920 --> 00:31:12.562
… Brandon: and engage.

00:31:12.564 --> 00:31:16.404
And I think for me, the shows are the
same thing, is if you can get in front

00:31:16.405 --> 00:31:21.586
of people, have a conversation with
people, um, have dialogue, frankly we'll

00:31:21.589 --> 00:31:26.205
have dialogue for three years, and then
maybe after three years and seeing me on

00:31:26.206 --> 00:31:29.087
a repetitive basis, you'll be like, "All
right, I've got to get one of these now."

00:31:29.312 --> 00:31:32.013
And I think that that's a very real
thing, and I think for a lot of

00:31:32.033 --> 00:31:35.985
entrepreneurs and a lot of the persons
that are starting these companies

00:31:35.987 --> 00:31:40.479
is understanding frankly that that's
the legwork that has to be made.

00:31:40.793 --> 00:31:41.084
Yeah.

00:31:41.084 --> 00:31:47.892
And whether that's windups or Intersex
or local shows or, uh, meetups, you

00:31:47.893 --> 00:31:52.686
know, whether that's Red Bar chapters
or more local chapters, there is

00:31:52.687 --> 00:31:56.971
a massive community of people, um,
around the country, frankly around

00:31:56.972 --> 00:32:00.700
the world, that if you engage in in
an honest way and I think in a real

00:32:00.700 --> 00:32:03.055
way, it's amazing, quite honestly.

00:32:03.055 --> 00:32:08.122
It, it, it, it frankly is, is a more
interesting part of, if you want…

00:32:08.176 --> 00:32:11.549
I don't ever consider what I do a
job, but it's the more interesting

00:32:11.562 --> 00:32:13.002
thing at the end of the day.

00:32:13.262 --> 00:32:16.615
And then of course, sales come
from that, and that's great, right?

00:32:16.622 --> 00:32:16.993
David: Yeah.

00:32:17.643 --> 00:32:18.662
That's really amazing.

00:32:18.944 --> 00:32:22.054
Do you, um… How about things
like, uh, you know, there's watch

00:32:22.068 --> 00:32:25.482
bloggers, there's all kinds of
newsletters, there's YouTubers.

00:32:25.504 --> 00:32:28.380
Do you sometimes provide watches
to them just to kind of feed

00:32:28.380 --> 00:32:29.671
the machine or not really?

00:32:29.783 --> 00:32:32.966
Brandon: Not… I haven't done that
much of it, and frankly because I just

00:32:32.966 --> 00:32:34.770
don't produce enough products, you

00:32:34.772 --> 00:32:35.075
David: know?

00:32:35.075 --> 00:32:35.085
Yeah.

00:32:35.630 --> 00:32:37.812
Brandon: You know, I think it's
very different when it's your money.

00:32:37.824 --> 00:32:40.476
We used to say that a lot in our
other organizations, like treat

00:32:40.476 --> 00:32:41.628
it like it's your money, right?

00:32:41.633 --> 00:32:45.149
So for me to give a
watch away is a big deal.

00:32:45.205 --> 00:32:45.511
Yeah.

00:32:45.514 --> 00:32:47.176
Um, even if it's on loan.

00:32:47.479 --> 00:32:54.793
And, um- I tend to s- sort of put
my time and investment in meeting

00:32:54.795 --> 00:32:56.370
people one-on-one personally.

00:32:56.373 --> 00:32:57.124
Yeah.

00:32:57.124 --> 00:33:00.009
So, um, you know … And, and by the way,
I've met other blog- I've met bloggers

00:33:00.026 --> 00:33:02.493
where they're like, "Hey, I'm in town.
I'd love to see your watches, and I

00:33:02.500 --> 00:33:05.520
have a travel case, and I'll meet you
up for coffee or I'll meet you out."

00:33:05.815 --> 00:33:09.484
Um, and we'll do it that way, and we'll
take photos and be supportive of it.

00:33:09.779 --> 00:33:13.465
Um, but I haven't really engaged
in this sort of, like, pay-to-play

00:33:14.071 --> 00:33:15.839
gi- gifting a lot of watches.

00:33:15.870 --> 00:33:18.159
I have gi- Sure … I have gifted some.

00:33:18.161 --> 00:33:23.915
And the way that I use it as a, is, um, my
read on it is if you in- if I'm inspired

00:33:23.915 --> 00:33:29.595
by who you are and what you're doing and
the narrative or the s- or the resources

00:33:29.595 --> 00:33:33.303
you're bringing to whatever it is you're
doing, frankly, some people have gotten

00:33:33.305 --> 00:33:34.872
cold calls from me and be like, "Hey, man.

00:33:35.042 --> 00:33:36.084
You just inspire me.

00:33:36.084 --> 00:33:39.561
I'm gonna bring you … I'm gonna send
you a watch for free." No … A- and

00:33:39.561 --> 00:33:41.089
I don't really ask anything in return.

00:33:41.110 --> 00:33:42.055
Frankly, I never have.

00:33:42.056 --> 00:33:44.216
I've never been like, "You have to
wear it, and you have to give me-"

00:33:44.216 --> 00:33:45.023
David: Sure, of course

00:33:45.028 --> 00:33:45.550
… Brandon: or whatever.

00:33:45.782 --> 00:33:50.776
Um, but there are, uh, and for every, who,
those who, who, who are, who hear this,

00:33:50.776 --> 00:33:52.122
like, they, they'll know who they are.

00:33:52.122 --> 00:33:56.601
There's probably five, maybe 10
folks out there around the world

00:33:56.601 --> 00:33:59.662
where I've been like, "You know
what? You've just inspiring, been

00:33:59.662 --> 00:34:03.934
inspiring me on a consecutive basis.
Frankly, I want you to have a watch."

00:34:04.201 --> 00:34:04.639
David: Yeah.

00:34:04.902 --> 00:34:05.723
Brandon: And, and that's it.

00:34:05.777 --> 00:34:08.277
Um, and, but that's the only
way really I've engaged in it,

00:34:08.344 --> 00:34:09.556
uh, on that side of things.

00:34:09.598 --> 00:34:10.027
David: Yeah.

00:34:10.645 --> 00:34:14.012
I also love the fact, by the
way, that you've got, uh, it's

00:34:14.014 --> 00:34:16.049
a very well-curated collection.

00:34:16.051 --> 00:34:18.719
Like, right now on the website,
I think there's five models.

00:34:18.793 --> 00:34:19.052
Brandon: Yeah.

00:34:19.052 --> 00:34:19.062
Yes.

00:34:19.085 --> 00:34:21.328
David: And the pricing
is also very consistent.

00:34:21.367 --> 00:34:21.677
Brandon: Yes.

00:34:21.822 --> 00:34:24.393
David: So just in case people are
wondering like, "Oh my God, is this

00:34:24.397 --> 00:34:28.235
like a three, four, $5,000 watch?"
Dudes, you gotta get some of this.

00:34:28.248 --> 00:34:29.795
It's 1650.

00:34:30.065 --> 00:34:30.199
Yeah.

00:34:30.223 --> 00:34:33.766
1650, 1750, all below 2500 bucks.

00:34:34.252 --> 00:34:36.377
By the time this airs,
the prices might go up.

00:34:36.377 --> 00:34:36.844
Yeah.

00:34:36.844 --> 00:34:38.455
So jump on this now, people.

00:34:38.455 --> 00:34:38.485
There you go.

00:34:38.485 --> 00:34:38.667
There you go.

00:34:38.667 --> 00:34:39.724
Jump on this now.

00:34:39.809 --> 00:34:40.184
Brandon: Yeah.

00:34:40.313 --> 00:34:43.570
David: I'll tell you what else I hate,
and maybe you've got an opinion on this.

00:34:43.942 --> 00:34:49.092
A lot of the micro brands, they do
these, like, super limited releases.

00:34:49.284 --> 00:34:49.447
Yeah.

00:34:49.447 --> 00:34:50.587
And then they sell out.

00:34:50.587 --> 00:34:55.016
And by the time you hear of it, even two,
three weeks later, you go to the website.

00:34:55.016 --> 00:34:58.698
You're all excited, your credit card
is out, and they go, "Sorry, sold

00:34:58.699 --> 00:35:01.076
out. Coming … More coming in 2027."

00:35:01.083 --> 00:35:01.350
Brandon: Yeah.

00:35:01.350 --> 00:35:01.360
Yeah.

00:35:01.567 --> 00:35:03.497
David: And you're like, "Are
you in the business of selling

00:35:03.513 --> 00:35:05.353
watches or just teasing people?"

00:35:06.367 --> 00:35:06.677
Brandon: Probably

00:35:06.677 --> 00:35:07.278
David: a little bit of both.

00:35:07.282 --> 00:35:10.371
So what's your take on that sort
of limited availability, limited

00:35:10.371 --> 00:35:11.893
run kind of thing that they do?

00:35:12.040 --> 00:35:12.574
Brandon: Yeah.

00:35:12.607 --> 00:35:14.016
The, it's all over the place.

00:35:14.016 --> 00:35:16.259
I mean, there's this … And b-
by the way, we do a little bit of

00:35:16.261 --> 00:35:20.804
it as well, is- Uh, there's just
thousands of philosophies around that.

00:35:20.875 --> 00:35:23.395
Uh, and it's- that's a
whole nother podcast.

00:35:23.410 --> 00:35:24.326
But, um-

00:35:24.346 --> 00:35:24.973
David: Sold

00:35:24.985 --> 00:35:28.129
… Brandon: to me, it was, you know,
and we did versions of this in

00:35:28.132 --> 00:35:29.538
every job I've ever been in.

00:35:29.938 --> 00:35:31.819
Limited editions, one of a kind-

00:35:32.005 --> 00:35:32.264
David: Yeah

00:35:32.395 --> 00:35:38.232
… Brandon: to, uh, 250 of a kind to- Sure
… whatever number, 500, 1,000, where you're

00:35:38.232 --> 00:35:42.711
like, "It's not even. It's just a run."
So I do like, I do like having a sense of

00:35:42.732 --> 00:35:46.221
where a watch or, or, um, originated from.

00:35:46.221 --> 00:35:48.661
So ours are numbered in series.

00:35:48.926 --> 00:35:50.629
Um, nothing is limited.

00:35:50.643 --> 00:35:52.600
It can go in or it can go away.

00:35:52.837 --> 00:35:55.408
Um, but you can reference
back that I bought this watch

00:35:55.408 --> 00:35:56.969
in this batch on this year.

00:35:57.288 --> 00:35:57.634
Yeah.

00:35:57.634 --> 00:36:00.410
Uh, 'cause it gives its provenance,
it gives it a space and time where

00:36:00.589 --> 00:36:03.694
it might mean a lot to you that you
were one of the first purchasers of

00:36:03.696 --> 00:36:07.661
number one of that series of that year,
and I think that that's a fun thing.

00:36:07.663 --> 00:36:09.231
I think that's nice to be a part of.

00:36:09.573 --> 00:36:12.833
And that's, we've pretty much
put ourselves in that bucket.

00:36:12.857 --> 00:36:15.399
You know, 'cause we, when we started
doing some of the shows, I was like,

00:36:15.400 --> 00:36:18.332
"Oh, we're gonna do limited editions,"
and everyone was like, "Why?" Like,

00:36:18.372 --> 00:36:19.881
to your point, they're like, "No.

00:36:19.913 --> 00:36:21.276
Like, just sell a cool watch.

00:36:21.404 --> 00:36:23.553
Like, you make one, keep
selling it forever."

00:36:23.786 --> 00:36:24.027
Yeah.

00:36:24.038 --> 00:36:28.223
Uh, and I was like, "Okay, I'll do
that." So we, we pivoted there, but we

00:36:28.223 --> 00:36:30.741
do do a run of hand-engraved versions.

00:36:30.989 --> 00:36:34.169
Uh, and those by the specificity
of they're one-of-a-kind,

00:36:34.212 --> 00:36:36.995
hand-engraved, those we auction off.

00:36:37.005 --> 00:36:38.964
So those are done on an online auction.

00:36:38.964 --> 00:36:42.895
We did one, uh, last year,
um, that was one of a kind.

00:36:43.067 --> 00:36:45.604
I ran it for a month as an online auction.

00:36:45.630 --> 00:36:46.852
Everybody could partake.

00:36:46.998 --> 00:36:48.772
Highest bidder takes it home.

00:36:49.790 --> 00:36:50.636
Ready to go.

00:36:50.685 --> 00:36:52.145
And so we'll do some of that.

00:36:52.172 --> 00:36:54.520
We're really- Yeah … you know,
part of the watch, the way that it's

00:36:54.522 --> 00:36:58.529
engineered, is that we, I want it
to be able to engage in that hand

00:36:58.529 --> 00:37:00.618
skill component, that engraving.

00:37:00.618 --> 00:37:02.856
We were working with tattoo
artists, hand engravers.

00:37:03.145 --> 00:37:08.645
Um, and so there is a nice part of that
where you can go all in, make something

00:37:08.645 --> 00:37:13.799
incredibly unique, and give someone
that experience, um, and give that

00:37:13.801 --> 00:37:16.354
craftsperson, frankly, that experience.

00:37:16.633 --> 00:37:19.143
And then on the flip side, you
know, I think for us, or at

00:37:19.143 --> 00:37:22.810
least for RTFACT, if something is
working, we'll always carry it.

00:37:22.810 --> 00:37:22.820
Yeah.

00:37:22.979 --> 00:37:26.218
If something's not working, it's
been serialized and numbered,

00:37:26.250 --> 00:37:27.788
and frankly, we'll move on.

00:37:27.929 --> 00:37:28.220
Yeah.

00:37:28.220 --> 00:37:31.234
And there's always, you know,
creative juice in the, in the,

00:37:31.451 --> 00:37:33.073
in the pot, so, like, why not?

00:37:33.083 --> 00:37:35.537
Why hold yourself to something
if you don't have to?

00:37:35.656 --> 00:37:36.194
David: Sure.

00:37:36.221 --> 00:37:36.982
Absolutely.

00:37:37.226 --> 00:37:39.531
Well, as we're landing the
plane, I'm curious about

00:37:39.531 --> 00:37:41.011
your own personal collection.

00:37:41.019 --> 00:37:43.875
Do you s- still have a pretty
large watch collection, or

00:37:43.886 --> 00:37:45.201
have you sort of let that go?

00:37:45.304 --> 00:37:48.594
Brandon: I sold a giant chunk last year.

00:37:48.698 --> 00:37:48.845
I

00:37:48.861 --> 00:37:49.865
David: kept- I missed your sale.

00:37:49.890 --> 00:37:51.212
I missed your sale, dude.

00:37:51.212 --> 00:37:51.884
Come on.

00:37:52.076 --> 00:37:52.913
Brandon: It was legit.

00:37:52.961 --> 00:37:54.944
A guy came in and almost bought it all.

00:37:54.978 --> 00:37:56.042
It was pretty amazing.

00:37:56.368 --> 00:38:00.477
I've kept pretty much everything
I've ever worked on to a degree.

00:38:00.522 --> 00:38:03.822
Um, you know, a lot of the original
Zodiacs that we re-kicked off,

00:38:03.822 --> 00:38:05.520
I've kept a good chunk of those.

00:38:05.692 --> 00:38:05.966
David: Yeah.

00:38:06.131 --> 00:38:10.037
Brandon: Um, some really amazing
prototypes, you know, examples-

00:38:10.040 --> 00:38:13.611
Nice … like that, non-production
stuff- Yeah … I tend to hold on to.

00:38:13.613 --> 00:38:17.817
I've got a handful of those from
Shinola as well, and then some

00:38:17.819 --> 00:38:19.248
other things landing around.

00:38:19.248 --> 00:38:22.460
And then now, I mean, you know, it's
interesting once you now have your own

00:38:22.471 --> 00:38:24.017
watch, like, you wear your own watch.

00:38:24.018 --> 00:38:24.295
So you're-

00:38:24.296 --> 00:38:24.598
David: Yes

00:38:24.618 --> 00:38:27.147
… Brandon: sort of like, you know,
the Rolexes and other things

00:38:27.147 --> 00:38:30.308
I acquired, frankly, I sold
off, 'cause it's toys for toys.

00:38:30.529 --> 00:38:30.875
David: Yes.

00:38:30.895 --> 00:38:35.109
Brandon: Um, and, and at least for
my boys, I have two sons, um, is, you

00:38:35.109 --> 00:38:39.794
know, for them, I think going forward
they're more interested in wearing

00:38:39.794 --> 00:38:45.314
what Dad made, like, and, and was maybe
more close to Dad's name than- Yeah

00:38:45.332 --> 00:38:47.859
maybe something that, you
know, I worked on at Richemont.

00:38:48.134 --> 00:38:51.694
Um, but I've got a couple of pieces out
there that I'm gonna go back and acquire.

00:38:51.886 --> 00:38:55.218
I didn't get the, uh, I had
worked on the Grand Sun Moon

00:38:55.473 --> 00:38:57.361
collection for the Reversos.

00:38:57.589 --> 00:39:01.308
Um, I never ended up picking up one
of those, so that's on my hit list.

00:39:01.319 --> 00:39:01.330
Yeah.

00:39:01.587 --> 00:39:06.060
So I'm gonna go back, I think, a few eras
and pick up the things that I wished I

00:39:06.060 --> 00:39:07.259
I didn't have the means.

00:39:07.259 --> 00:39:09.589
I mean, this is one of the funny things
when you're working at Richemont Group

00:39:09.589 --> 00:39:14.144
is all of a sudden you believe that
you should own what you're making.

00:39:14.295 --> 00:39:14.953
David: Of course.

00:39:14.991 --> 00:39:19.074
Brandon: And, and of course you do
over time, but you often, like, y-

00:39:19.091 --> 00:39:23.886
you get amnesia to the fact that
it's still a, a $15,000 watch, right?

00:39:23.915 --> 00:39:25.239
David: Totally, or a lot more.

00:39:25.444 --> 00:39:26.906
Brandon: And, yeah, a- and now a lot more.

00:39:26.906 --> 00:39:29.754
I mean, this was back, you know,
this was 25 years ago, or, you

00:39:29.754 --> 00:39:30.833
know, almost more than that.

00:39:30.834 --> 00:39:33.372
But, um- So that's always kind of funny.

00:39:33.439 --> 00:39:33.695
Um-

00:39:33.702 --> 00:39:34.180
David: Yeah

00:39:34.190 --> 00:39:37.389
… Brandon: but, you know, um, but yeah, I've
got a, I got a, have a decent collection.

00:39:37.390 --> 00:39:41.056
But I, I also don't mind
letting go of stuff.

00:39:41.463 --> 00:39:43.886
You know, I like to collect,
I like to… And, and I think

00:39:43.921 --> 00:39:47.520
I've met a lot of collectors now
that are okay with letting go.

00:39:47.520 --> 00:39:49.949
I mean, they've got a couple
of things, grail items if you

00:39:49.949 --> 00:39:51.027
wanna call it, that they're like-

00:39:51.032 --> 00:39:51.451
David: Sure

00:39:51.624 --> 00:39:53.350
… Brandon: never, but it's fun.

00:39:53.404 --> 00:39:53.803
Collecting's fun.

00:39:53.803 --> 00:39:57.061
David: What kind of channels do you, when
you want to sell a watch, what kind of

00:39:57.061 --> 00:39:58.717
channels do you sell through typically?

00:39:58.764 --> 00:39:59.815
Brandon: I like these shows.

00:39:59.840 --> 00:40:00.815
I like the collectors.

00:40:00.826 --> 00:40:03.218
So, you know- Ah … now that I've
been able to meet people, it's-

00:40:03.219 --> 00:40:03.476
David: Sure

00:40:03.476 --> 00:40:07.186
… Brandon: it's super fun to be at a big
table and everyone's got watches out.

00:40:07.372 --> 00:40:07.623
David: Yeah.

00:40:07.624 --> 00:40:10.264
Brandon: And be like, "Oh, I…" You know,
and some of it's bartering, some of it's

00:40:10.265 --> 00:40:11.021
David: selling-

00:40:11.021 --> 00:40:11.719
Brandon: Sure … stuff.

00:40:11.720 --> 00:40:14.317
I think that's the most fun,
'cause then you know, I do like

00:40:14.317 --> 00:40:17.067
knowing- Where it's going, right?

00:40:17.082 --> 00:40:17.549
David: Sure.

00:40:17.571 --> 00:40:23.079
Brandon: And that the, um, appreciation
for it, whether it was a $60 thing or,

00:40:23.299 --> 00:40:27.251
you know, a few thousand dollar thing-
Yeah … um, is, is gonna be taken

00:40:27.251 --> 00:40:29.063
care of and passed on in the right way.

00:40:29.063 --> 00:40:32.996
And I think that that's really a nice
way of offloading watches when you can.

00:40:33.392 --> 00:40:36.820
Bigger stuff, I mean, if it's gold
or if it's got a high, high value,

00:40:36.820 --> 00:40:40.898
of course you can always go to a,
a jewe- a, a dealer or a jeweler.

00:40:41.100 --> 00:40:44.320
And, you know, they, they also work…
I've done that on one watch, a Deepsea

00:40:44.322 --> 00:40:49.200
Dweller, um, where I wanted another very
specific watch, and I was like, "Hey,

00:40:49.752 --> 00:40:52.808
I'll give you this one. Let's work on
a price for this one." And so that-

00:40:52.808 --> 00:40:53.178
David: Yeah

00:40:53.230 --> 00:40:54.685
… Brandon: I've done that as well, so.

00:40:55.214 --> 00:40:55.920
David: Amazing.

00:40:56.136 --> 00:41:00.881
Well, my final question is, any parting
words of wisdom to a new collector,

00:41:00.892 --> 00:41:04.360
someone who's just getting into watches,
just kinda getting their feet wet?

00:41:04.838 --> 00:41:06.226
Brandon: Just enjoy it.

00:41:06.683 --> 00:41:11.030
I think the market's gotten
better at releasing the snobbery

00:41:11.057 --> 00:41:14.121
around, well, it has to be this-
Yeah … or it has to be that.

00:41:14.639 --> 00:41:16.954
Frankly, enjoy a vintage Casio.

00:41:17.492 --> 00:41:19.196
Enjoy a Pulsar.

00:41:19.196 --> 00:41:23.091
And I think you got a Pulsar in back of
you, or an Accutron, or- Yeah … and

00:41:23.092 --> 00:41:27.458
get your feet wet and get into the
enjoyment of having these things,

00:41:27.780 --> 00:41:29.918
and then start doing your research.

00:41:29.937 --> 00:41:30.670
Go to the shows.

00:41:30.671 --> 00:41:35.748
I tell everyone, "Go to these
shows." It is the best version,

00:41:35.748 --> 00:41:37.642
I think, of the watch market.

00:41:38.046 --> 00:41:39.490
All the collectors are there.

00:41:39.527 --> 00:41:42.170
They're all wearing all sorts of watches.

00:41:42.336 --> 00:41:42.661
David: Yeah.

00:41:42.722 --> 00:41:46.341
Brandon: Um, and it starts a dialogue,
it gets you involved in the community,

00:41:46.680 --> 00:41:48.474
and just start enjoying it, you know?

00:41:48.474 --> 00:41:49.504
And, and don't, don't…

00:41:49.925 --> 00:41:55.645
Yes, the, the beautiful, you know,
$50,000 this, this, or that are amazing.

00:41:55.646 --> 00:41:56.737
Yes, they're amazing.

00:41:56.999 --> 00:42:00.050
But frankly, everything
below it's amazing as well.

00:42:00.330 --> 00:42:04.810
And, and I think you'll have a better
appreciation for when you do score maybe

00:42:04.810 --> 00:42:09.896
that grail watch, you know, whatever that
is for you, if you cut your teeth on some

00:42:09.896 --> 00:42:14.004
of these other watches first, and get
into wearable product and fun product.

00:42:14.349 --> 00:42:18.399
And I think that that's, uh, that's the
beauty of watches, is literally you could

00:42:18.400 --> 00:42:22.097
collect from, from 50 bucks to the limit.

00:42:22.125 --> 00:42:24.292
Yeah, you could multi-million dollar-

00:42:24.534 --> 00:42:24.912
David: Yeah.

00:42:25.040 --> 00:42:25.460
Brandon: Yeah.

00:42:25.486 --> 00:42:26.845
Whatever you want, right?

00:42:27.073 --> 00:42:27.896
And it's all great.

00:42:27.896 --> 00:42:34.192
And by the way, I've never met a watch
maker, designer, brand owner who has,

00:42:34.319 --> 00:42:35.993
who doesn't have that collection.

00:42:36.763 --> 00:42:36.910
David: Yeah,

00:42:37.167 --> 00:42:39.611
Brandon: there isn't a person
that just collects this.

00:42:39.991 --> 00:42:40.265
David: Yeah.

00:42:40.306 --> 00:42:42.417
Brandon: Um, and I, that's probably
not the collector you wanna be

00:42:42.417 --> 00:42:46.506
around anyway, 'cause that's
a commodity-based, uh, hedge.

00:42:46.558 --> 00:42:49.176
You know, they're, they're trading
watches as a, as a retail thing.

00:42:49.192 --> 00:42:49.620
David: Sure.

00:42:49.665 --> 00:42:52.109
Brandon: And I think, you know, most,
most buyers will say, "Oh, yeah, I've

00:42:52.111 --> 00:42:57.274
got that, that black Casio," or, "I've
got that black, you know, um, Swatch

00:42:57.294 --> 00:42:59.279
or, or old Fossil," or whatever.

00:42:59.283 --> 00:42:59.656
David: Yeah.

00:42:59.721 --> 00:43:00.297
Brandon: And they love it.

00:43:00.314 --> 00:43:03.603
They love it just as much as maybe
the one that they've gotten as their

00:43:03.604 --> 00:43:06.466
careers or their lives afforded
them a higher price point, so.

00:43:06.906 --> 00:43:07.752
David: Absolutely.

00:43:07.765 --> 00:43:07.785
Yeah.

00:43:07.801 --> 00:43:10.256
Well, Brandon Little, thank
you so much for being with us.

00:43:10.256 --> 00:43:12.607
You are a rock star, and I appreciate you.

00:43:12.711 --> 00:43:13.350
Brandon: Thank you, David.

00:43:13.350 --> 00:43:14.317
I really appreciate it.

00:43:16.562 --> 00:43:19.163
David: And that wraps up
another episode of Watch Smarts.

00:43:19.194 --> 00:43:24.042
Listen, if you love this show, if you
love watches, subscribe, download,

00:43:24.095 --> 00:43:27.957
leave us a rating or review on
your favorite podcast platform, and

00:43:27.959 --> 00:43:32.986
check out all the free resources
waiting for you at watchsmarts.com.

027: From Richemont Luxury to Detroit Soul with Brandon Little

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